@Sirdanest So, to answer your last question, one of the reasons the "NCR" questline is such a trainwreck is the person in charge, Devilswish if I remember correctly, demanded complete control over the story and threatened to go if someone so much as suggested any changes. Unfortunately for everyone involved, he can't write a story to save his life.

Now, a lot of people have the idea that maybe they can fix it and make it decent, something I don't think it's possible. I haven't played the mod but what I've heard is that if you completely ignore the story and just explore the area, it's actually a pretty nice. The problem is the factions that inhabit the frontier, and thus the story built around those factions, are so bad, that there's no such thing as fixing the mod, it would have to be remade from scratch.

Do you know how the NCR is a preindustrial nation, extremely limited in man power and resources, with not much in terms of technology, trying their best to civilize the wastes with what they have? Do you know how that's essential to their story? Well, what if instead they were this military superpower, with space-faring vertibirds, tens of thousands of troops, and a massive heli-carrier that would make the Prydwin look like a piece of trash?

Do you know how the legion is a brutal slave army, where its members are conditioned from childhood to have no fear or empathy, just absolute obedience to Caesar? What if instead, everybody was kind of doing their own thing, nobody cared very much what Caesar says, and common grunts shouted "Fuck Caesar, I ain't dying" when their health is low?

Do you know how most legion soldiers use football gear because this is a poor, backwards society that doesn't have resources to properly equip its troops so they have to scavenge? How centurions use composite armor, which is a big deal because it's how they prove their worth as warriors? How Lanius is the only one who uses actual metal armor designed for him which is an even bigger deal? What if instead, every single grunt was wearing metal armor exactly like the one Lanius wears? What if so called "gladiators" that aim to prove their worth were wearing centurion armor?

Do you know how in NV, the legion finds a Howitzer and that could make a huge difference in the battle for Hoover Dam, but they can't actually use it because it's broken, so there's a whole quest to repair it? What if the northern legion had like dozens of those?

Do you know how the whole thing about the BOS is their technological fanaticism? What if they wore chainmail and used swords instead? What if they were mormons? Except not really (they drink coffee, use latin sometimes and paint crosses on their armor), they are more like pseudo Catholics, but the devs wanted to call them mormons in a cheap attempt to tie them to the Honest Hearts DLC. And what if they were mostly made up of Asian women who were experimented on by Elijah? And what if they had cat fights about the meaning of feminism?

Do you know how there are no tanks in the Fallout universe because the US military abandoned the idea in favor of individually armored soldiers (Power Armor)? What if there were tanks everywhere instead?

Do you know how Big Mt is full of technological wonders that you can't find anywhere else because they were top secret, ultra advanced government projects that never made it to the public? What if you could find stores and factories selling those products?

Look, I could keep going for hours. The devs don't like or understand New Vegas (It's been confirmed many of them haven't even played the game), they don't understand or care for the Fallout universe, they don't even understand what a post apocalyptic world is. They wanted to create a COD-esque mod, which is exactly what they produced. And like I've said many times, it's absolutely baffling to me why anyone would spend 7 years doing something like that as if you couldn't get that experience from 10 other franchises, and not have to deal with the bugs and limitations of the Gamebryo engine.

It's not as simple as removing the bad and polishing the good. The very foundation of the mod is absolutely awful.

I still can't believe people are talking about this trainwreck
Everybody knows the mod is awful. What I am interested is if somebody salvaged anything from the remains yet. I know xi-whatever, the guy behind vehicles, made a standalone mod that doesn't require fallout frontier(of dev's fetishes), but there are plenty of other assets that could very well be ported into FNV or even F3 or F4, with some work. I myself am interested in that fireworks launcher myself, as I think it would make for an good makeshift weapon one could make when playing as a mad bomber type who's handy with a wrench

The map itself could also be salvaged and made into something workable, assuming the NPCs and factions are gutted. The NCR and Legion would also have to be completely revamped, most likely so that it's the mojave counter parts and that neither is anywhere near as powerful as in the current product(portland legion having several howitzers when even repairing one over in the mojave made a big deal is a good example). The enclave would have to be removed, or have minimal presences, something between what we saw with NV and F3, and not a part of a storyline in any way(maybe as a 4th secret ending where you find them and help them acquire power to overthrow the other factions). I think the crusaders can be salvaged the best, assuming we fix Odin's asian female fetish, remove most named NPCs and fix some stupid plot points with them. I don't think anyone is up for that, and we haven't even gotten to the side quests and exploration yet, that's why I think it's best to simply gut the map and make something new from it, or simply leave it as a place for exploration that one can go to. I myself never expected much more out of this mod than simply being able to explore a large, snowy landscape with some vehicles, and a minimal story mod to boot, similar to point lookout and honest hearts back in the day(minus the vehicles)

Honestly, for the NCR quest I was expecting to do more boots on the ground missions, like capture Legion bases, sabotage the Legion's efforts, battle Legion forces throughout Portland alongside NCR forces, and assassinate High-ranking Legionaries. More quests for the NCR, like win the support of local settlements who will join the NCR Exiles providing soldiers and resources for the Exiles. Some quests involve the Courier helping expand NCR Exile influence throughout Portland, and that these quests can help ensure NCR Exile survival.

Plus, I thought the Courier being captured would happen later in the mod. And well it would make sense for something like that to happen later on, especially with that massive assault following the Courier's capture (Where the Courier is someone who is actually valuable having completed prior quests for the NCR Exiles and has garnered fame, as opposed to being the new guy.)

Or instead of the Courier being captured, the Courier joins that all-out air assault to assassinate Valerius, and this comes about as a result of the player helping NCR Exiles after weakening Legion. This comes from the Courier aiding the NCR in capturing Towns/Outposts, defeating Legion forces in battle, assassinating high-ranking Legionnaires, and sabotage. But they would be forced to retreat due to Valerius not being there, luring NCR forces into a trap.

I was expecting the Space section to be the final part of the questline, not the middle. Or heck, rework it as a side quest so that it's a bunch of Ex-Enclave Soldiers (Similar to Arcade Gannon in terms of their views on the Enclave) who deserted and are disillusioned with the Enclave's goals of Purifying Earth and the mad experiments of Voss and Argus. And so these Ex-Enclave reach out to the Courier to help them take back or destroy Archimedes. In the Archimedes, it's the Courier who is backed up by a bunch of disillusioned heavily-armed Ex-Enclave Soldiers rather than a rag-tag NCR team. And should the Courier beat Archimedes Quest, these Ex-Enclave Soldiers end up joining the NCR or Legion (Finding that they have no place to go and that the NCR Exiles as these Ex-Enclave have knowledge on high-tech stuff they allow them to join. As well, they aren't like their crazy genocidal brethren.), just like that Enclave scientist in Archimedes who joins.

Everything happened so fast, and I found myself increasingly disappointed with the NCR questline. I was literally expecting quests where I would fight in epic battles alongside NCR forces against the Legion rather than go to space or experience hallucinations/nightmares.

The Vault 9 section would be better relegated as a side quest rather than the main quest.

Also, I really wanted an option for the NCR Exiles to make peace with the Crusaders in the NCR Campaign and an ending where the NCR Exiles don't get screwed over and are dissolved as a force. As well, I also wanted to go head-to-head with the Crusaders throughout the NCR Questline as opposed to meeting them in the silo.

For Wolfpack, a wasted potential that they were killed off early in the mod, I expected to do more missions with them throughout the NCR Questline rather than die off rescuing the Courier.

In the case of the NCR Exiles, I would rework them. Rather than being an army of deserters, instead they're just an Expeditionary Force sent to scout out potential expansion in the Frontier. As well scavenge technology for the NCR effort.

I mean I liked the worldspace and the new equipment they made, but I seriously hated the quests.

I have not played it yet.

For anyone who might be interested:

The Frontier is Recruiting

Not sure how much good it will do but if you hate the mod and want to fix it, this might be right up your alley.

@Tribal Raven I don't intend to tell anyone else what to do but for me personally, other than the fact that I doubt they would have me (seeing as they're not the most tolerant people when it comes to different opinions) I think this is one of those times when the expression "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me" applies.

A person who has seen the whole debacle unfold, who knows who the members of the team are, who knows what the frontier is and has to offer, and still thinks it's a good idea to get attached to this project is someone who is making decisions in a very different way than I am.

TGSPY is a liar and a deviant. Demonstrably so. He is scum. The mod isn't Fallout in the slightest. If only the NCR quest was the only problem with that mod. And considering the amount of people that have left and all the content they've had to delete, it's going to take quite a while just to bring it back to the same place it was at launch.

This isn't something I would advice anyone to touch with a ten foot pole.

I don't understand why this mod is getting so much hate, there are so many quest mods out there that are just as lore-unfriendly. Sure there's a lot of cringe (like how the frontier NCR has such a huge boner for the courier) but this is a huge mod with dece voice acting and cutscenes and a bunch of quests, that was released for free 11 years after the game came out. I totally get people not liking a mod and moving on but I've seen so many posts and 30 min + youtube videos dedicated to shitting on this mod. Was there a patreon for this or something? If people paid then I guess I understand

For anyone that is defending it still, I recommend Rimmy's videos... or for those hating it and want to watch an Australian Guardsman Talk about it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqZPd29NcSQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-3YjqXOzhA

HEY GUYS! I FOUND THIS!!!!

https://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/71044

Maybe you are right

Spoiler:

A big technological marvel, hobble by poor storytelling and vastly inappropriate content, spearheaded by an egotistical, undisciplined writer/developer. It's a shame considering the long wait, and the impressive work done in the engine, but there's a clear divide between the best aspects of Frontier and the worst. Some of the weapons, for example, have vastly different degrees of quality, some look fantastic, some are simply reskins, and others are just gawd awful. Same with the quality of the voice acting and audio capture. This is all piled on top of a mediocre (at best) story.

Then you get into the really ugly stuff, the "adult" (I'd put that in the biggest air quotes I possibly could) content being just trashy and uncomfortable. This is coming from a series where you can play a fluffer or a porn star previously, and yet that was delivered more tastefully and turned out entertaining.

Then you get that underhanded behavior of the lead team. One of their artists, someone that they would have worked with for at least a few years and somehow none of them ever knew what kind of content this person's artwork consisted of (?), yeah I don't by that either. But what he was a great scapegoat when they needed to take the heat off themselves. Specific use of trigger words in their statement such as "pedophile" was used almost certainly because of the connotations that would instantly leap to mind in most people when they read it. This is despite the fact that this person had nothing to do with the main content of the game, or anything of the "mature" (giant air quotes) themes. They were responsible for some custom icons, and refitting female armor pieces to match the models better. But the rest of the team was more than happy to throw them right under the bus.

This mod is forever stained by all of this, the poor delivery, the questionable content, the unprofessional behavior of key figures involved... even if they made a huge turn around, who would trust them again after all of this?

yuzus wrote:

I don't understand why this mod is getting so much hate, there are so many quest mods out there that are just as lore-unfriendly. Sure there's a lot of cringe (like how the frontier NCR has such a huge boner for the courier) but this is a huge mod with dece voice acting and cutscenes and a bunch of quests, that was released for free 11 years after the game came out. I totally get people not liking a mod and moving on but I've seen so many posts and 30 min + youtube videos dedicated to shitting on this mod. Was there a patreon for this or something? If people paid then I guess I understand

I think it's a lot like what happened with 2077. The hype. It happened to some degree to New California as well, a LOT of hate for so much free amateur-made material. They were all hyped to death for years, and then fell short of what people were expecting. If New California and Frontier had both released silently, without warning, without advertising, without years of hype... just one day, they were on the nexus... sure, there might have been some negative reviews but they wouldn't have veered into "You ran over my dog!" level of rage.

Gamers can have VERY strong expectations and when those expectations are not met with precision, the energy put into the internet raging exceeds their rage toward terrorism or war or anything the non-digital world, as far as I can tell.

To me... it's just a game. It's not deadly important. Not really.

Yeah, maybe there's something hypocritical about me expressing all this irritation at people expressing irritation.

Sirdanest wrote:

yuzus wrote:

I don't understand why this mod is getting so much hate, there are so many quest mods out there that are just as lore-unfriendly. Sure there's a lot of cringe (like how the frontier NCR has such a huge boner for the courier) but this is a huge mod with dece voice acting and cutscenes and a bunch of quests, that was released for free 11 years after the game came out. I totally get people not liking a mod and moving on but I've seen so many posts and 30 min + youtube videos dedicated to shitting on this mod. Was there a patreon for this or something? If people paid then I guess I understand

I think it's a lot like what happened with 2077.  The hype.  It happened to some degree to New California as well, a LOT of hate for so much free amateur-made material.  They were all hyped to death for years, and then fell short of what people were expecting.  If New California and Frontier had both released silently, without warning, without advertising, without years of hype... just one day, they were on the nexus... sure, there might have been some negative reviews but they wouldn't have veered into "You ran over my dog!" level of rage.

Gamers can have VERY strong expectations and when those expectations are not met with precision, the energy put into the internet raging exceeds their rage toward terrorism or war or anything the non-digital world, as far as I can tell.  

To me... it's just a game.  It's not deadly important.  Not really.  

Yeah, maybe there's something hypocritical about me expressing all this irritation at people expressing irritation.  

^this.

I understand if you paid money for content, such as a AAA title that turned out to be shit.

But free content, even shitty free content shouldn't enrage someone to the level that I saw with The Frontier.

Love or hate the mod, team, lead developer, story, whatever but if this is the kind of thing that enrages you to the point of sending death threats or anything similar, then YOU are the problem and the one being toxic.

@yuzus @Sirdanest @Tribal Raven A lot of people don't understand why anyone would even talk about the game at all, but I mean, is it really that surprising? People are naturally going to want to discuss whatever is going on in the community and, for a while, the Frontier is what was going on in the community.

You also have to remember, the problem isn't the mod itself. The mod is abysmal and it deserves all the criticism it gets - being free doesn't make it immune from criticism - but the problem is that the developers decided to antagonize the community. Had this been handled by sensible adults, the situation would've turned out in a very different way.

If you decide to rile up a community, you can't be that surprised when they take it personally, specially when it comes to issues like pedophilia that people tend to react very viscerally to.

Isn't it remarkable that the frontier hype and trailers seem to have completely hidden all of the crap that was eventually found in the game?  
I mean, the trailers could have featured the horny lizard people, or half a dozen other things, but I don't think they did.  
I'm pretty sure the CDPR devs knew that the hype for 2020 was bullcrap and hid the problems.  To me the trailers looked jaw-dropping.
But the frontier devs seemed blindsided by the hate, like they had no idea.  So it was just luck that the hype and trailers and all that didn't show any of the nonsense at all... I guess?

Edit:
I also watched a playthrough of the first 45 minutes and damn, maybe bullets and fists are going to come through my screen for saying this, but it looked more amazing, by a good margin, than Vanilla New Vegas. It looks _really_ impressive. If a lot of it is at that level, then yes, i think it can be saved by a dedicated team of editors. I mean, take out the lizards or edit their dialogue or whatever. Take out the pedophilia, obviously. The military scenes in the first 45 minutes? If there's more of that I'm probably going to be tempted to try it despite all the hate. It looks completely saveable to me, so far.
Kind odd how the quality (so I hear) drops off so radically and wildly. A "showrunner," editor, director, etc., should have been an obvious position to edit and keep the whole project in order.

@Sirdanest Watch the 4 Decent Friends playthrough, which starts here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kY_pNUg3Ez0

Or Rimmy's Fallout: The Frontier is a God-Awful Fustercluck

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqZPd29NcSQ

Or really any other of the hundreds of videos made about the mod. They will disabuse you of that notion.

I'm not saying that the little they got right wasn't good. I'm saying that this mod has some of worst writing you'll ever encounter, the story is a mashup of different franchises that makes no sense and it's cringe as hell, the mod doesn't resemble Fallout one bit, the developers that created it are abysmal writers, most of them have never even played New Vegas and the ones who did didn't like it, and even though the military bits are good if you're into that (I'm not) there's 20 different franchises out there that will give you the same experience, so if you want to play COD, I would think it'd be better to just play COD, not go through the effort of modding NV in order to play a discount COD in an ancient engine.

I've not played it yet. Not sure if I want to even though all the hype got me excited for it's release. Probably should avoid hyping things up so much.

Also for some reason it interferes with some npcs from other mods with the message [He has nothing to say] so I just uninstalled it.

slackboy wrote:

For anyone that is defending it still, I recommend Rimmy's videos... or for those hating it and want to watch an Australian Guardsman Talk about it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqZPd29NcSQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-3YjqXOzhA

HEY GUYS! I FOUND THIS!!!!

https://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/71044

That video has at least one lie, so I would take it with a grain of salt and look for other resources, if anyone is interested in this trashheap
Particularly, he's wrong about certain screenshots being doctored. They, and the posts within them, are 100% real, but were deleted once the person who made them realized just how retarded he sounded. You could even check the discord logs to confirm this, altho at this point, I bet they were purged. This makes me think the discord trannies over at the frontier discord server fed rimmy a bunch of bullshit in attempt at damage control, and he sold it to his gullible fanbase(his videos seem to be aimed at teenagers)
Thankfully, the controversy was big enough that it was well documented

gavin gold wrote:

Who's laughing now?
- Some guy named Todd.

7 years in the making. A dev team almost the size of a professional one. And the result?

- Degeneracy
- Bugs
- Pedophiles
- BLABLABLA

Seriously, just WHAT.THE.HELL?  

EDIT: *After further research it has been confirmed that most of the lead devs either hated or had never played NV.

Dear lord you are so toxic

Seriously ? Seriously  what ?.. unistall dont play and dont be toxic ....


And the content and scripting.. creatures some extras are the best i see in last years ... yeh maybe some hidden content or rare content in such a huge file mod.. but if you come from a generation crystalsito ... please unistall and dont be toxic




NOTE :
Who's laughing now?
The Frontier 364.100 Downloads

@erafox The best you have seen? Really? Are you one of those people who supported the mod on patreon for years? Or perhaps just friends with one of the furries or scalies in the development team? If you feel such a need to defend this atrocity, you could at least make it believable.

Oh, and just one more thing:

erafox wrote:

NOTE :
Who's laughing now?
The Frontier 364.100 Downloads

Still Todd. Fallout 76 numbers have soared since the fiasco. That's how bad the mod was  

And 4Chan.

And the Sneedclave.

gavin gold wrote:

@erafox The best you have seen? Really? Are you one of those people who supported the mod on patreon for years? Or perhaps just friends with one of the furries or scalies in the development team? If you feel such a need to defend this atrocity, you could at least make it believable.

..no friend or patreon ... and as i said you are so toxic this remember me to old threads on fallout3underground forum .back days GUN ....back to the past with this post

so bye