@VelociraptorDude All the stuff Zu did for which he was booted out is years old. And the guy published them under his exact same username. There's absolutely no way they didn't know. Also, like you say, the guy was just a 2d artist. Odin wrote America, Nazo wrote Mae and the lizard sex dungeon, Phobos voiced one of the lizard Queen's breeders, TGSPY is friends with at least two diaper furries...

Zu is a degenerate but he is definitely NOT the reason the mod is what it is. He was a scapegoat.

gavin gold wrote:

@VelociraptorDude All the stuff Zu did for which he was booted out is years old. And the guy published them under his exact same username. There's absolutely no way they didn't know. Also, like you say, the guy was just a 2d artist. Odin wrote America, Nazo wrote Mae and the lizard sex dungeon, Phobos voiced one of the lizard Queen's breeders, TGSPY is friends with at least two diaper furries...

Zu is a degenerate but he is definitely NOT the reason the mod is what it is. He was a scapegoat.

Absolutely. It's a shame, since some of the functions in it are impressive, and could've been used for superior projects. Ah well, hopefully this project can serve as a warning for both modders and the people that use mods.

I'd say calling it the worst in history is an exaggeration. It's certainly a disappointing disaster, but the worst mod ever... It didn't contain a virus or game breaking bug like that blood overhaul in Skyrim. It also pushes the engine to limits I doubt even Bethesda thought possible. Certainly some talented people worked on it (I'm referring to the vehicles and stuff). In terms of video games, it's much more a Cyberpunk than a Road to Hell Retribution.

man, just returning to play new vegas and saw it, now im not sure if I try or just pass, but need something new to try, really dont worth it?

@Fyrehart1997

Gavin Gold wrote:

When I say it's the biggest disappointment it modding history, I don't mean it's the worst mod ever made. That's very much impossible to say, Nexus alone hosts hundreds of thousands of mods. And how do you compare something like this to mods that might change a few textures or add one new monster? They're just different things.

In terms of expectations however, this might have been the most hyped up mod in history. People downloaded it so much on release that Nexus crashed. And not only did they failed to live up to those expectations but the whole thing went up in flames. I have genuinely never seen such a huge fail.

@Seifer Let me put it like this: If playing a discount COD/Wolfenstein/Call of Kojima built on the bug infested gamebryo engine, with awful textures, tons of lorebreaking, zero compatibility and pretty much none of what you like about NV sounds good to you... Sure, go ahead. If not, there really isn't anything there for you.

gavin gold wrote:

@Fyrehart1997

Gavin Gold wrote:

When I say it's the biggest disappointment it modding history, I don't mean it's the worst mod ever made. That's very much impossible to say, Nexus alone hosts hundreds of thousands of mods. And how do you compare something like this to mods that might change a few textures or add one new monster? They're just different things.

In terms of expectations however, this might have been the most hyped up mod in history. People downloaded it so much on release that Nexus crashed. And not only did they failed to live up to those expectations but the whole thing went up in flames. I have genuinely never seen such a huge fail.

@Seifer Let me put it like this: If playing a discount COD/Wolfenstein/Call of Kojima built on the bug infested gamebryo engine, with awful textures, tons of lorebreaking, zero compatibility and pretty much none of what you like about NV sounds good to you... Sure, go ahead. If not, there really isn't anything there for you.  

ahahaha love the comparsion, you convinceme, I already install a zombie apocalypse for now, tnx! :

Seifer wrote:

gavin gold wrote:

@Fyrehart1997

Gavin Gold wrote:

When I say it's the biggest disappointment it modding history, I don't mean it's the worst mod ever made. That's very much impossible to say, Nexus alone hosts hundreds of thousands of mods. And how do you compare something like this to mods that might change a few textures or add one new monster? They're just different things.

In terms of expectations however, this might have been the most hyped up mod in history. People downloaded it so much on release that Nexus crashed. And not only did they failed to live up to those expectations but the whole thing went up in flames. I have genuinely never seen such a huge fail.

@Seifer Let me put it like this: If playing a discount COD/Wolfenstein/Call of Kojima built on the bug infested gamebryo engine, with awful textures, tons of lorebreaking, zero compatibility and pretty much none of what you like about NV sounds good to you... Sure, go ahead. If not, there really isn't anything there for you.  

ahahaha love the comparsion, you convinceme, I already install a zombie apocalypse for now, tnx! :

Yeah, better off to get a mod like Dust, than the Frontier. There's awful stuff, but, not awful stuff as in lorebreaking snake people that have "breeders"

@Seifer when you say you just got back into New Vegas, how long were you away? Because New California looks really good, if you haven't tried it yet

Fyrehart1997 wrote:

@Seifer when you say you just got back into New Vegas, how long were you away? Because New California looks really good, if you haven't tried it yet

yay! completly agree, New california was great, I been play a loot, but never heard about The Frontier, just watch a couple of videos today

Hi, I'm going to tell you why you're wrong. First of all, this mod would perfectly be paid content BUT IT IS NOT and I appreciate this, its duration is 65h and this is insane, it contains new locations, characters, weapons, VEICLES, TANKS AND WTF VERTIBIRDS and much more. Having so much content it is obvious that there may be mods but if they were The script may not be the best but its creators put so much love on it that it shows when playing it, they implemented vehicles and vertibirds to be used and this would be unthinkable that the game engine is limited and not designed for these things, this is to applaud. Also instead of being your adventure in some moments it is more a generic fps, but the experience is appreciated. If there were some pedophiles or sexual deviants in their creation, the others do not have to be, do not put them all in the bag for one. If you want something more relaxing on the subject of sexual content or etc, go play barbie or things like that, Fallout 1 has a very marked black homor and I did not see anyone complain about this. regards

tarkerim wrote:

Hi, I'm going to tell you why you're wrong. First of all, this mod would perfectly be paid content BUT IT IS NOT and I appreciate this, its duration is 65h and this is insane, it contains new locations, characters, weapons, VEICLES, TANKS AND WTF VERTIBIRDS and much more. Having so much content it is obvious that there may be mods but if they were The script may not be the best but its creators put so much love on it that it shows when playing it, they implemented vehicles and vertibirds to be used and this would be unthinkable that the game engine is limited and not designed for these things, this is to applaud. Also instead of being your adventure in some moments it is more a generic fps, but the experience is appreciated. If there were some pedophiles or sexual deviants in their creation, the others do not have to be, do not put them all in the bag for one. If you want something more relaxing on the subject of sexual content or etc, go play barbie or things like that, Fallout 1 has a very marked black homor and I did not see anyone complain about this. regards

Hi, I'm going to tell you why you're wrong. First of all you have a very strange criteria for quality, the cheaper, longer and more filled with features it is, the better? It depends on the quality of given features. 65h can be super tedious and a lot worse than a good 6h campaign. It might be good from a technical point of view but this discussion is more about the quality. Vehicles also may not be exclusive to this mod forever.
You say they put SO MUCH LOVE into it but call it "generic fps " and "the script could be better"? Seems like a contradiction.

Your comment on the pedos is also questionable. We know there were multiple people that put their kinks into this mod. Also multiple people had to know about what skunk was doing, so it's definitely not just one person.
Telling people to just play with barbies if they don't like weird kinky stuff in fallout and don't want to support people like Skunk is pointless for the discussion and really childish.

I actually think most of the Barbie movies have a higher level of quality (relative to their audience ofc) and know and care for their target audience a lot more than the frontier does, they don't put fetish stuff in them either.
They also seem to be more original than "Oh look were in snow" and "lets steal scenes from MGS 3 and Wolfenstein". So that might be an unironically good tip on your part.

For your last point, I dont understand that comparison. You are correct that nobody complains about F1s humor but I don't think that black humor would be the correct term for frontiers type of "humor". I'd rather call it sadistic and misogynistic to such a degree that even the people wit the darkest sense of humor would not get any enjoyment out of it.
I would count myself to that group.

tarkerim wrote:

Hi, I'm going to tell you why you're wrong. First of all, this mod would perfectly be paid content BUT IT IS NOT and I appreciate this, its duration is 65h and this is insane, it contains new locations, characters, weapons, VEICLES, TANKS AND WTF VERTIBIRDS and much more. Having so much content it is obvious that there may be mods but if they were The script may not be the best but its creators put so much love on it that it shows when playing it, they implemented vehicles and vertibirds to be used and this would be unthinkable that the game engine is limited and not designed for these things, this is to applaud. Also instead of being your adventure in some moments it is more a generic fps, but the experience is appreciated. If there were some pedophiles or sexual deviants in their creation, the others do not have to be, do not put them all in the bag for one. If you want something more relaxing on the subject of sexual content or etc, go play barbie or things like that, Fallout 1 has a very marked black homor and I did not see anyone complain about this. regards

While I get the tones of the original Fallout games, and even later members of the franchise were dark, I don't think they ever outright had an option to keep a potentially underaged character as a sex slave, an underage character that draws pornography, or romancing snake people and deathclaws.

The script comes off as being crudely slapped together scenes from other franchises, and makes little to no sense at all. While some of the features of the mod are admittedly impressive, it is heavily burdened by its flaws. I do respect your opinion on this however, and I think a civil discussion on this would be nice.

The Frontier is absolute garbage, no ifs ands or buts. However, it has all sorts of goodies under the hood that can be cannibalized for far better projects. The mad bastards managed to do some scripting sorcery with the Gambryo engine that folks didn't think was possible. As long as someone properly makes use of all the tools and tech that the Frontier team made, than this absolute flop will still be worth something.

@tarkerim

Quote :

First of all, this mod would perfectly be paid content BUT IT IS NOT

The fact that something is free doesn't mean it's above criticism.

Quote :

its duration is 65h and this is insane, it contains new locations, characters, weapons, VEICLES, TANKS AND WTF VERTIBIRDS and much more.

I don't care. The locations are mostly just copy-pasted from NV and FO3. The characters are all either clichés, mary-sue waifus, or absolute morons. The weapons are all ugly low res and many of them don't even look like they fit in the franchise. And the vehicles, while impressive that they managed to make them work on that engine, not only trash the lore, which would be bad enough in the first place, but they don't add anything to the game itself, it's just the devs flexing their skills.

Quote :

The script may not be the best

That's like saying Oedipus kind of liked his mom.

Quote :

Also instead of being your adventure in some moments it is more a generic fps, but the experience is appreciated.

Riiiiight... Because that's exactly what I'm looking for when I mod my game, turning NV into a generic fps.

Dude, for crying out loud, it's not as if NV is the only game out there. If you want to play COD, you can just go and play COD. What's the point of building a generic FPS on top of the gamebryo engine as if you couldn't get that experience from 10 other franchises?

Quote :

If there were some pedophiles or sexual deviants in their creation, the others do not have to be, do not put them all in the bag for one.

It's not just one, and with the exception of Zu, they are all still there.

Quote :

If you want something more relaxing on the subject of sexual content or etc, go play barbie or things like that

Not an argument, bro.

Quote :

Fallout 1 has a very marked black homor and I did not see anyone complain about this

Ah yes, the good 'ol false equivalency.

Nobody complains about Fallout One's humor because that's a well written game made by adults. You can have mature themes in your game, that's not an issue. It's not the same as filling a mod with your deviant sexual fantasies.

And if you are going to do that, if you are going to make a sex mod and fill it with your paraphilic disorders, then at least be honest about what it is. Don't try to pass it as a lore friendly, mainstream mod, only for players to discover lizard sex dungeons and porn obsessed children.

You are right on some points mate, with the quality criteria I mean not to detract from something that is free and that I have been developing for too long with people who did not earn a penny, if it has its failures but it entertained me by ignoring all that with the sex slave, the new breed with very rare dialogues and etc. Although its duration is quite a lot and it could obviously be shortened to be much more bearable, I appreciate it because I mostly enjoy it, if you don't like it, I understand and respect it. you are right about the vehicles but they were the first to implement them well, not like other mods like the motorcycle in nexus that is just a 3d model moving straight and without collisions looking horrible, instead the frontier vehicles so well that it is enjoyable use them. If you have put love on it, it seems like a generic fps for example the battle of elios 1 at the beginning of the mod, but parts like these cannot ignore the great work they did with the map, weapons and mechanics. the mod is fine but not perfect if you obvious the story is entertaining. Regarding what you say about farts, what I wanted to make you understand is that this mod was made by volunteers and taking into account that no type of outlet is being offered and it is very difficult to choose people will come to collaborate in it Statistical project of course that some of them are going to be peculiar in this way, however I do not think that the work of a whole group of people should be evaluated by the actions of one or some, less if this work took 7 years to develop.
If I was wrong with the barbie thing, thank you to make me see my mistake, but what I meant is that if having sex with a deathclaw seems disgusting to you and that the community does not stop doing fan arts with boobs or etc, you better play to another thing companion, with respect to the others it seems abhorrent to me by the echo of being unpleasant.
if a barbie movie had 7 years of development it would be much better xdd. I did not play MGS 3 and Wolfenstein so I guess you are right as I did not notice this plagiarism.
The humor comparison I did on the subject of deathclaw is a stupid joke in my opinion and I did not find it funny but I saw in some videos that it did.
Regarding the misogynistic and sadistic thing, I did not see anyone complain about clover the partner we acquired in Eulogy Jones in fallout 3 or killing benny with a sexual conversation in new vegas or that the reward of the blind my ride mission is to fuck red lucy. Thank you for making me see that in some points I was wrong

@tarkerim Look, pointing out that these people worked hard on the mod and released it for free doesn't say anything about the mod itself. The developers were working on a personal project, every minute they invested on it they did so because they chose to and wanted to. They weren't sacrificing anything to do so and they were being funded by the community.

You can make the argument that when something is free you should be more wiling to forgive its flaws because, after all, it didn't cost you anything. But that only goes so far. It doesn't mean that you can never in any context criticize it, and it certainly doesn't mean that you should be ignoring the fact that a mod that was supposed to be mainstream and lore friendly, so casually included pedophilia and bestiality.

I never tried to imply that every single person who worked on the Frontier is a deviant. Obviously, that's not true. However, one of the risks you run when you associate yourself with a project is that people are not going to be judging every single element individually, they are going to be judging the product as a whole. It's as if you and your buddies are going to prepare a pizza together, so you make a nice homemade tomato sauce, but everyone else just uses trash and rotten ingredients. Ultimately, the whole is more important than the sum of its parts. And on the issue of sexual deviancy, if you look into it, you realize it's not an isolated incident as many people think.

Mechanical and technical aspects are important but when the mod fails this badly, they become secondary. I can appreciate Xilandro's talent and the technical skill that it took for him to make those vehicles, but that feature fundamentally goes against the foundations of the franchise they are modding. In the Fallout universe there are no tanks, they abandoned the idea of armored vehicles in favor of individual armored units (Power Armor). The NCR is a poor pre industrial nation trying to civilize the wastes, they can barely spare ONE vertibird for their president, how are they in possession of hundreds of vertibirds (including space faring ones) let alone a massive heli-carrier. How would they even fuel those things?

Now, mature themes are difficult to write properly. Not everyone that can pull that off. In NV, you can find someone like Cook-Cook, who is a rapist, and a sadist, and a child abuser. But that's never treated lightly. He's portrayed as evil. People, especially poor people who might fall victim to the fiends, are incredibly scared of him. The NCR wants him dead because he's a monster. He tells a story about human cruelty and the unforgiving nature of the wastes. It isn't quite the same as allowing you to sexually enslave a girl for nothing else than your pleasure.

Have you noticed that, in NV, even though the Legion enslaves, rapes, beats and crucifies women, you can't ever do that? Why do you think that is? What do you think the response would have been if NV allowed the player to gratuitously engage in all that kind of cruel abusive behavior?

On the same note, one of the reasons why many games fail to allow players to properly roleplay as evil characters is that it is often difficult to find a balance between roleplay and reality. Most people have no desire to genocide an entire town, nor will they have the opportunity, thus, blowing up Megaton for instance, can pass as just harmless roleplay. Pedophiles and child molesters however, are a very serious, very real problem. And you don't want, or at least you shouldn't want, your game or mod to allow these people to live out their fantasies.

It doesn't mean you can't ever deal with these topics. But you need someone who knows how to approach them.

Having said all of that, if you are having fun with the mod, that's fine. I really don't understand the logic there, but don't let me stop you. However, let's not pretend as if there is nothing to criticize about it, because there is, and plenty.

You are right partner, although fallout 1 has black humor I never even amused myself with those controversial frontier events but I saw them as bad uncomfortable jokes and not as what they really are, a creation of pedophiles and sexual disturbed
If your script sucks, its technical aspects really outweigh its mechanics.

Thank you for making me see this, I was saddened only for having had an entertaining experience and because of ignorance I defended pedophilia and something very badly coordinated and carried out.

Yes, it is garbage but it has something useful underneath under its layers as you say to make things better but in this case they did not implement this well, thanks to the users I realized that it really is not as great as I thought.

hi, regarding this "The fact that something is free doesn't mean it's above criticism" the truth is that yes, if it's free you can't get rid of criticism, thanks for making me see that partner

Em if you look at comparisons on youtube and confirm what you say about the maps, and the characters clarify that the script is not the best because they did not have a good coordination to do it and it ended up being a giant wtf. Also the vehicles break the tradition of losing you on the way, when using the vehicle I lost about 10 locations xddd.

You're right friend, the fps parts of the game seemed a bit boring to me and I was able to realize this thanks to you, if I want an fps I can download any game from now on, I was just blinded by you have more or less a good experience with frontier and I didn't know how to see what was wrong with it, sorry

I do not really know all who are involved in the controversies bro, but I assure you that most do not have to be accused of pedophiles for the actions of a few I repeat.

I trade off the humor of fallout 1 with frontier for the bad deathclaw joke but otherwise he's too sickly.
if it is a real shit that some people have put this type of content in frotier. Thank you for making me see that I was defending something mostly indefensible and that for blinding me by having a more or less decent experience I defended pedophilia and misogyny

I think the frontier was to ambitious and tried to hard to be mulitiple genres of games it tried action, adventure, horror, and just some weird shit. Frontier was at its best it wasn't trying to hard and was just letting it flow. Overall a let down but was still something new to play so i played it and enjoyed what i could. Also in my playthrough i didn't see and game breaking glitches and i had 140+ mods enabled so rather stable at least for me.